https://www.state.gov/secretary-antony-j-blinken-with-margaret-brennan-of-cbs-face-the-nation-3/
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国务卿安东尼·布林肯 (Antony J. Blinken) 与哥伦比亚广播公司 (CBS) 的玛格丽特·布伦南 (Margaret Brennan) 面对全国
面试
安东尼·J·布林肯，国务卿
德国慕尼黑
2023 年 2 月 19 日 6park.com
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问：  我们现在请美国国务卿安东尼·布林肯来德国参加慕尼黑安全会议。国务卿先生，我知道你刚刚会见了你的中国外长王毅，他公开表示美国对间谍气球的反应是荒谬的、歇斯底里的，是为了转移对国内问题的注意力。他私底下对你那么不屑一顾吗？
 
布林肯国务卿：  玛格丽特，我不想描述他所说的话；我可以告诉你我说过的话。我向他明确表示，中国在美国上空发射监视气球——侵犯我们的主权，违反国际法——是不可接受的，绝不能再发生。我们也有机会谈论慕尼黑这里发生的事情，谈话的焦点——俄罗斯对乌克兰的侵略战争——以及我们对中国考虑为俄罗斯在乌克兰的努力提供致命支持的担忧。正如拜登总统与习主席分享的那样，我能够与他分享这将对我们的关系造成的严重后果。
 
最后，对我来说重要的是要强调，我们相信拥有沟通渠道，参与直接外交非常重要。我们有责任以负责任的方式管理我们的关系。这就是今晚的内容之一。
 
问题：  这是否意味着他们的国防部长将接听奥斯汀国务卿打来的下一个电话，而不是拒绝接听？
 
布林肯国务卿：  嗯，这是我们讨论过的事情之一，即拥有沟通渠道的重要性，包括军方之间的沟通渠道。确保没有沟通不畅、误解是至关重要的，尤其是当你遇到危机或其他一些情况时。
 
问：  是的。
 
布林肯国务卿：  所以我试图让我的中国同行记住，进行这些接触的重要性，包括军方之间的接触。
 
问题：  五角大楼一名高级官员上周表示，习近平主席对监视气球感到意外，他不信任自己的军队。难道中国政府的左右手不知道怎么回事吗？
 
布林肯国务卿：  我不能说这个，玛格丽特。但我能——我能告诉你的是：从中国对这一行动负责的意义上说，这无关紧要。最终，作为国家领导人，习主席负有责任。对我来说，代表拜登总统直接与中国最高外交政策官员分享这种情况绝不能再次发生的非常明确的决心，这对我来说很重要，这是其中一个原因。
 
问：  好吧，如果这位五角大楼官员科林卡尔的评论是准确的，那么如果中国无法控制自己的军队，就会增加误判的风险。所以我想让你澄清一下。
 
布林肯国务卿：  所以玛格丽特，我不能——再说一次，我不能就此发表中国人的看法。我只能想象，中国一定正在努力从这次事件中吸取教训。当然，我们不是唯一关心的人。中国在五大洲的 40 多个国家/地区使用了这些监视气球。所以我在慕尼黑这里听到的其中一件事是对监视气球计划的真正关注。我怀疑它被我们揭露的事实将不得不让中国重新审视它。
 
问：  我要回到你提到的向俄罗斯提供支持的问题上来。有公开报道称，中国公司正在向在乌克兰作战的雇佣军瓦格纳集团提供监控设备。美方是否认为这是在向俄罗斯提供军事支持？
 
布林肯国务卿：  我们从第一天起就担心这种可能性。事实上，如果你回头看看拜登总统和习主席就俄罗斯对乌克兰的侵略战争进行的第一次谈话——战争刚刚开始几周——拜登总统与习主席分享了我们对中国可能会采取行动的深切担忧。在这方面向俄罗斯提供致命支持，并系统地规避制裁。造成这种担忧的原因是，就在侵略发生前几周，你会记得习主席和普京总统举行了一次会议，他们在会上谈到了无限制的伙伴关系。我们担心其中——在缺乏限制的情况下，中国会在战争中支持俄罗斯。
 
我们一直在密切关注此事。迄今为止，我们已经看到了中国公司——当然，在中国也有
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Secretary Antony J. Blinken With Margaret Brennan of CBS Face the Nation
INTERVIEW
ANTONY J. BLINKEN, SECRETARY OF STATE
MUNICH, GERMANY
FEBRUARY 19, 2023 6park.com
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QUESTION:  We go now to Secretary of State Antony Blinken, who is in Germany attending the Munich Security Conference.  Mr. Secretary, I know you just met with your Chinese counterpart, Wang Yi, who has publicly said the U.S. response to the spy balloon was absurd, hysterical, and an effort to divert attention away from domestic problems.  Was he that dismissive to you in private?
 
SECRETARY BLINKEN:  Margaret, I don’t want to characterize what he said; I can tell you what I said.  I made very clear to him that China sending a surveillance balloon over the United States – in violation of our sovereignty, in violation of international law – was unacceptable and must never happen again.  We also had an opportunity to talk about what’s happening here in Munich, the focus of the conversation – Russia’s war of aggression against Ukraine – and concerns that we have that China’s considering providing lethal support to Russia in its efforts in Ukraine.  And I was able to share with him, as President Biden had shared with President Xi, the serious consequences that would have for our relationship.
 
Finally, it was important for me to underscore that we believe having lines of communication, engaging in direct diplomacy is very important.  We have a responsibility to manage our relationship in a responsible manner.  That’s part of what this evening was about.
 
QUESTION:  Does that mean their defense minister will pick up the next phone call from Secretary Austin instead of refusing it?
 
SECRETARY BLINKEN:  Well, it’s one of the things that we talked about, the importance of having lines of communication, including military-to-military lines of communication.  It’s vital to making sure that there aren’t miscommunications, misunderstandings, especially if you’ve got a crisis or some other situation on your hands.
 
QUESTION:  Yeah.
 
SECRETARY BLINKEN:  And so I tried to impress upon my Chinese counterpart the importance of having those contacts, including military-to-military.
 
QUESTION:  A senior Pentagon official said last week that President Xi Jinping was caught by surprise by the surveillance balloon and that he doesn’t trust his own military.  Did the left and right hand of the Chinese government not know what was going on?
 
SECRETARY BLINKEN:  I can’t speak to that, Margaret.  But what I can – what I can tell you is this:  It doesn’t matter in the sense that China is responsible for this action.  And ultimately, as the leader of the country, President Xi is responsible.  It’s one of the reasons it was important for me, on behalf of President Biden, to share directly with the most senior Chinese foreign policy official the very clear determination that this must not happen again.
 
QUESTION:  Well, if Colin Kahl, this Pentagon official’s comments are accurate, that would raise the risk of miscalculation if China doesn’t have control over its own military.  And so I wanted you to clarify that.
 
SECRETARY BLINKEN:  So Margaret, I can’t – again, I can’t speak to the Chinese views on this.  I can only imagine that China must be in the process of trying to draw its own lessons from this incident.  And of course, we’re not the only ones concerned.  China’s used these surveillance balloons over more than 40 countries across five continents.  So one of the things I’m hearing here in Munich is real concern about the surveillance balloon program.  I suspect the fact that it’s been exposed by us is going to have to cause China to take another look at this.
 
QUESTION:  I’m going to come back to what you mentioned in terms of providing support to Russia.  There is open-source reporting that Chinese companies are providing surveillance equipment to that mercenary group, the Wagner Group, fighting in Ukraine.  Does the U.S.  consider this to be providing military support to Russia?
 
SECRETARY BLINKEN:  We’ve been concerned from day one about that possibility.  In fact, if you go back to the very first conversations that President Biden and President Xi had about Russia’s war of aggression against Ukraine – just a couple of weeks into the war – President Biden shared with President Xi our deep concern about the possibility China would provide lethal support to Russia in this effort, as well as engage in the systematic evasion of sanctions.  And the reason for that concern was, just weeks before the aggression, you’ll remember that President Xi and President Putin had a meeting in which they talked about a partnership with no limits.  And we were concerned that among those – among the lack of limits would be Chinese support for Russia in the war.
 
We’ve been watching this very closely.  To date, we have seen Chinese companies – and of course, in China there’ 6park.com